Why do we so often picture the “lone genius,” when in reality the most powerful ideas often emerge from groups, improvisation, and unexpected collaboration? How does creativity reshape the way we think about education, learning, and even everyday human interaction?

Today’s guest is Dr. R. Keith Sawyer, one of the world’s leading experts on creativity, learning, and collaboration. Trained in both cognitive psychology and performance studies, Keith blends the rigor of academic research with the lived experience of a jazz pianist and improvisational theater performer. He is the author of influential books such as Group Genius and Explaining Creativity, which challenge traditional myths of creativity and explore how innovation emerges from collective dynamics.

In this episode, we explore Keith’s groundbreaking perspective on creativity as an improvisational and collaborative process rather than the product of isolated genius. Drawing from his research on jazz ensembles, improv theater, and classroom interactions, Keith shows how creativity emerges from the dynamic interplay between people and ideas. We discuss why the myths of the “big idea” and “linear insight” often hold us back, and why schools must move beyond rote knowledge to cultivate what Keith calls “creative knowledge”—deep, connected, and adaptable understanding that fuels true innovation.

Our conversation dives into what it means to improvise in everyday life, how adaptability is at the heart of creativity, and what happens when organizations, educators, and even children learn to embrace uncertainty as an opportunity. Keith’s insights remind us that creativity isn’t just about art or invention—it’s about how we live, learn, and move together through an unpredictable world.